I'm getting irritated.  I've been looking for a while for a long-haired chi breeder or a toy poodle breeder who do all the health tests they should, and can't find any.

My research indicates toy poodles should be tested for both types of PRA, Von Willebrands disease, patella luxation, and blood tested for thyroid function.  All I can find are breeders who DNA test for one form of PRA (and don't eye test for the other).  None of the ones I can find test for any of the other things.

The other dog I would like is a long-haired chihuahua.  Finding breeders who health test at all is darn near impossible.  Best I've found is one who tests for heart problems, but not for eyes.  The three big tests in chi's, I believe, are luxating patella, eyes, and heart.

Am I being over-zealous?

Can anyone help me?

Have you contacted breed clubs?

I was just wondering whether the info you have on required health tests is UK or US based?

Obviously a breed is a breed, but there are sometimes problems in specific populations not seen in other countries and if the bloodlines do not contain any common stock, say through imports then a specific problem may not be relevant.

Also re Patellas here in the UK there is no scheme or registry that lists patella results, but a GP vet can check a dogs patella's if there is concern, so there won't be any certification, but the breeder is likely to have had this aspect checked when they had the breeding stock at the Vets for their vaccinations etc.

Again with Thyroid we do not have a database or scheme for testing and ti is largely only tested for if an individual shows a problem that indicates thyroid trouble,a nd t hen of course the results would figure in a breeders breeding plans.

A bitch I bred that is now in the USA has recently just had all her OFA certs and they included Hips Patellas(which are not a breed problem), and Kidney function (which our breed in UK have decided to keep and eye on as other countries think there may be a problem).

Thyroid again is considered an Issue in the USA (I wonder if they see more of it because of the extra chemicals used on dogs for heartworm etc etc and the prevalence of early neutering).

So in USA they want Hips eyes, thyroid and Kidneys tested, in UK we are looking at hips and Eyes compulsory for club members with it suggested we check kidneys for monitoring reasons.  We have not had enough thyroid problems to suggest it is a problem.

What health testing do the British breed clubs advise?  If for all those above problems then maybe the club secretaries can find you the breeders that so them all.

I've tried the chihuahua breed club, they make no mention at all of any health problems on their website, and the toy poodle breed club doesn't have a website.

The information on health issues I got from here: http://www.napoleon.org.uk/health/poodlehealth.htm for toy poodles, which is a UK site.  I can't remember now where I got chi information from.

Does anyone know any good breeders of either then?  People you would recommend?

We have some Poodle owning regulars so hopefully someone can steer you.

Have you spoken to the club secretaries with you concerns.

Would there be anything on the Code of Ethics thread on the Breeding page?   Just a long shot!

Agree that is where the health testing is mentioned in my breeds website.

I dont have a toy poodle but have looked at toys and miniatures. They dont test for patellas and thyroid problems in this country and von willebrands is only really done is standards, where it is recommended.  As far as I can see. Its proving difficult to find a code of ethics, I might email the min club to ask them to put one on, I dont think toys have a website though. I admit I was surprised at the little tests done in the smaller varieties when standards have about four. And there isn't an SA test for mins and toys, is it not a problem in them? Soon one of our breeders will be here to reply with much more knowledge than me.

The KC pages have this -DNA Screening - prcd-GPRA Poodle (Toy) which may be of use to you

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/cgi-bin/item.cgi?id=1492&d=pg_dtl_art_news&h=242&f=0

I have a friend who has smooth chis and we have been trying to find out about checking patellas with not much joy. If only they ran a scheme like the English Toy Terriers do, they even offer a grant to help members with costs which is brilliant!!

http://www.english-toy-terrier.co.uk/breed.htm

I have Border Collies and the amount of testing we have to do is huge!! But that's another subject altogether.........sadly.

Patellas - in the UK there is no scheme or registry that lists patella results, but a vet can check a dogs patella's and as long as the vet fills the results in on one of the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals offical forms the owner can then sends the results off and a certificate will be given, see website for more details http://www.offa.org/patluxinfo.html

As most people have mentioned there is no scheme that recognises test result in the uk for chihuahuas, however, most breeders do have their stock at least once overed by a vet before any mating takes place, usually to check patellas, for heart murmurs and some eyes.

I personally would appreciate a recongnised testing scheme and think it is long overdue given the increase in this breed as a cash cow for some owners over the last 5 years and the increase in dogs with patella problems.

Why don't you give the secretary of the BCC a call to discuss this?

Thanks both of you for replying, really good of you both.

I'll check that web link and I am thinking of giving the secretary of the Breed Club a ring, although that feels a little uncomfortable as I don't actually own Chis. I still think they should know that "Joe Public" are concerned about the health of the breed and there is very little to do with health on their site which seems a little "off" to me.

Personally I am a bit shocked that a breed that has been reg with the KC for a very long time (I believe late 1800/early 1900 but am probably totally wrong!) has no official testing, but a breed like mine (BC's) which has only been officially recognised by the KC since the mid 70's has testing, lots of it, for pretty much everything.

Mini, do you have Chis? and are you in the UK? Hope you don't mind me asking, only I am trying to find people that my friend can relate to and that can help and encourage her in her quest to produce sound and healthy Chis that conform to the breed standard and look the part in the show ring. (Big task, but completely possible over time)

Thanks again

No problem, if you phone and make sure its not a call on a 'confrontational/preachy' basis and you just want to have a sound discussion, I'm sure you'll find it constructive.

In answer to your questions - yes and yes.  If you want to pm me we can have a chat.

> Also re Patellas here in the UK there is no scheme or registry that lists patella results, but a GP vet can check a dogs patella's if there is concern, so there won't be any certification, but the breeder is likely to have had this aspect checked when they had the breeding stock at the Vets for their vaccinations etc.
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Very true.  I have heart, eye and patellas done by my own veterinarian.  Knowing that I won't use a Long Coat Chihuahua with these problems, he's over zealous and checks at first vaccs, 6 month puppy check, annual boosters, and if he sees them in between!  He is very, very thorough with my eye checks, and I'm happy that he is.  The recent litter (that I kept for myself), he knows I want to show the dog, and keep the bitch for breeding.  He was so thorough checking those patellas - I thought he was going to pull a leg off!  But glad to say he found no probs!  I had assumed that having these checks is common practise.